SPEAKER_02 0:05

Welcome to the Good Old Blades Podcast. I am your host, Aaron Levere, and I'm joined with my co-host, Chris Crawford.

SPEAKER_03 0:21

Thank you for listening in to the Good Old Blades Podcast. I am your host, Aaron LeVere, and I'm joined by my co-host Chris Crawford.

SPEAKER_01 0:28

Hello.

SPEAKER_03 0:29

And and we are joined by special guest, Stanley Buzik. But Stanley, uh for the record, uh we know we were talking earlier before the podcast and everything started, and uh uh your name originates uh from a Czech origin. Can you actually pronounce what your last name is supposed to sound like?

SPEAKER_00 0:51

Yeah, it it's supposed to sound like Muzik. And it's like it you've got to pretty much it it's kind of like being a native speaker. If you're not a native speaker, it's just hard to do. So uh uh I usually don't I just tell people that it's it's like music but with a P and it it just makes it easier for everybody.

SPEAKER_03 1:17

I I have the same problem with Levere. I can't tell you how many times I've had like Lawrence or Laverne and I'm like Laverne and Shirley, I don't get it, but um you know the the interesting uh uh part about your your Czech background is I I I don't think a lot of the nation recognizes how closely uh how closely related uh Czech culture is with Texas culture. And for like uh country music fans, uh you know, West Texas and places like that are are often mentioned, but you know, you have like the Kalachi, uh Kalachi culture in West Texas. Everybody on I-35 as they're going through West has to stop at the Czech stop or Slava Czechs. But I I I I kind of want to talk a little bit about that, like your your origins uh with with your uh Czech culture and how you grew up and everything and how that influences you today.

SPEAKER_00 2:16

Well, yeah, we you know the Czech culture, a lot of it is in in or around West Texas, which everybody knows is close to the Waco area, but really the biggest part of of the the Czech infrastructure started in the late 1800s, early 1900s, and more around Lagrange, Ellinger, Columbus, down to El Campo that away. Um my um my grandfather came over in I think it was 1890, 1891, something like that. My uh my grandmother came over in 1906. They actually came in wooden sailing ships into the port of Galveston and then took ox carts to the Ellinger uh Lagrange area where they settled at the beginning. And then um uh then my grandmother and grandfather moved to south of Rosenberg and uh sharecropped out there where where my uh my dad and my uncles were all born and raised there. And uh so really I am only second generation American. Um uh we're we're fully ingrained in the in in in the the Czech culture.

SPEAKER_03 3:38

That's really exciting. So um do you often scoff at people who uh refer to kolaches for anything that is uh dough-shaped like a sausage roll or a fruit kolachi?

SPEAKER_00 3:52

Uh no, it's you know, that's I sometimes I just giggle. You know, I remember my grandmother making uh a club, you know, kolachi and and and klebastics and when I was a kid. But yeah, anymore if if it's if it's if it's a piece of dough with some fruit on it or even a sausage wrap, you know, it's a kolach. Sometimes you just shake your head, but it's it there's nothing you can do.

SPEAKER_01 4:21

I don't know if it's because I'm from Mississippi and not Texas, but I have no idea what y'all are talking about. I'm thinking of a burrito.

SPEAKER_00 4:32

Uh okay, there you go. Well, a kolach, a kolach, colach, is usually a uh they make them in a big pan. It's all squares of dough, and and they have either different fruit fillings or cream cheese or something like that in the center of them. It's a pastry. It and it's a heavy bread sweet pastry. And then, but now it's been kind of co-opted and and they call kolaches in it, and we call them clubasy. It's a piece of sausage wrapped in the same dough and baked. Um so it it's just it's a whole pastry type thing. It's it's it's like the it's a Czech donut.

SPEAKER_03 5:15

Yeah, so Chris, uh Texas, Texas 101, uh colachis and that other thing. I I can't even pronounce it, but maybe maybe it's because I was originally from Pennsylvania. So a Yankee in the South.

SPEAKER_00 5:26

Yeah, and and everybody says kolachis, and and it's not it, and that's a little bit from the I think the Hispanic, uh, a little bit of part of it, but but it's actually a kolach is the way you say it. And and there is no really no plural. It it's either one or a bunch, you know. It's it's still a colach.

SPEAKER_03 5:45

That's uh that's really interesting. Um so kind of on that note, uh, talk a little bit about your your life outside of knives. So I mean, I know that you covered a little bit about your your ancestry and immigration, but um what if if our listeners want to know about Stanley the person, not just Stanley the knife maker, uh, where does that start up?

SPEAKER_00 6:13

Um I guess Stanley the person is to show how stubborn I can be at times. It's um I was raised a lot by my grandmother and grandfather and on my dad's side, and they were of Czech or Czech origin. So I learned I I learned to spoke a lot of Czech when I was when I was a young kid. And um we moved away from Rosenberg into Houston, and I started elementary school, first grade, and I um uh about the first about three or four or five days into school, the my mother gets a call uh and they go, Does this boy speak English? And she goes, Yes, he speaks English very well. And she goes, Well, not here at school. And um when I got home that day, I realized that from then on I would speak English very well at school. So um that was and so I've always been kind of hard-headed and outside the you know, outside the box. And uh, but um most of my life I spent as a truck driver. And for, you know, 38 years, that's I sat behind steering wheel and and run up and down the road uh all over the country. Um stumbled into knife making in my late 40s. I mean, I started I only started knife making in in in uh in 2003, so I'm going on 20 years this year. But uh truck driver, uh got a couple of fine daughters, few grandkids, and um just um now I live on a a small working ranch uh with some of my wife's kin folks, and uh that's what we do now.

SPEAKER_03 8:00

Um so uh can you talk a little bit about how you you got into knives? Like what was your uh your first impression with knives? I I read a little bit on your website about your origin stories and uh and and knives as a kid, but I think it'd probably be better for our listeners if they heard it from from you.

SPEAKER_00 8:19

Oh, okay. Well, there again, we uh kind of goes back to my grandmother and my grandfather. Um my uh uh three of my dad's brothers were all in World War II. And um two of them were in the Navy, and uh they were they were stationed in the Navy in the South Pacific. And uh so one of my uncles made a what what everybody considers a theater knife. And um, and I can remember from the time I was small, is my grandmother using he when he got out of the Navy, he he came back to Texas for a while and he he gave that knife to my grandmother. And my grandmother used that knife in her kitchen from the time I was big enough to remember, um, up until she passed away, and then the knife came to me. I still have the knife today. Um, so I've always been a knife nut. My dad bought me my first pocket knife. I think I was eight or nine years old, and it was one of those little red-handled case uh barlows that you see on on every cardboard uh placard in um in every hardware store that you ever walked into. And you know, I carried that knife till uh I just I turned the blades into shoestrings. So I've always been a knife nut. But then uh I um I was actually in Abilene, Texas, and there was a guy set up there with a with a grinder and uh a set of paper wheels, and he was sharpening knives, and I had him sharpen my knife, and he did a pretty good job. And uh so um at that time I was just carrying a just a standard case trapper and uh and or a buck 301 stockman, and um so I kind of put two and two together and I go, Well, if he's got these paper wheels, somebody's bound to sell them. And I found Texas Knife Maker's supply. And so I called them up and said, Hey, y'all have these paper wheels for sharpening knives? And they go, Yeah, we do. And I go, Cool, I'll be down there in a little bit. I was only about 35, 40 minutes away from them. Well, I walked in the store that day and it was all downhill from there. Uh, I think I I think I spent a couple of hundred bucks that day in kits and and handle material and various things just going for a set of paper. Oh, and I did get the paper wheels. And uh so that's where it started. And uh I started out putting kits together, put maybe a dozen, maybe 18 kits together, something like that, and then figured out, well, I can grind my own blade. And um, so I started there, and it's just grown and grown exponentially since um I've gone from passion to obsession, if if you want to put it that way.

SPEAKER_01 11:17

Hey Stanley, you you uh mentioned that your grandfather had made that theater knife, and what first came to my mind was like a prop knife, but then you said your grandmother used it in the kitchen. Can you explain what you meant by a theater knife?

SPEAKER_00 11:32

Ah, yes, and it was it was actually one of my uncles, not my grandfather, it was one of my uncles that made the theater knife while they were stationed well that's right. While they were on they were both, they were both on a both come on Mal. They were both on an aircraft carrier in the South Pacific. And so he made the theater, what people call theater knives. There were tons of them made during World War II when the guys didn't have anything else to do, they would they'd make knives. And you so they call theater knives because you had some that were made in the European theater, you had some that were made in the in the African theater, you had some that were made in the Italian theater, or you had in South Pacific, the South Pacific theater. So they the general those handmade knives of of the of the the troops from World War II are all called theater knives. And so that's where that came about. And actually the theater knife that I have, um, the theater knife that I have was the the blade was a bandsaw blade out of the machine shop. Uh brass and aluminum was scavengered off of old landing gears when the the planes would hit the deck too hard and bend and break stuff. They scavenged up the aluminum, and uh the handle material is actually uh fighter canopies, uh, some of the earliest Lexan and Plexiglass and uh uh used for the handle material. So that's where I got my theater, that's where theater knives come from.

SPEAKER_03 13:01

So you have this uh uh theater knife and er and early yeah, slip joints and pocket knives as a as a uh background for experience. How does that play a role into the knives that you make today? Is there anything uh specifically about that, those experiences that you had as a kid or um getting into knives originally that interested you the most or plays a role in the kind of blades that you make?

SPEAKER_00 13:28

Um I guess from the you know from the culture I came from, you know, everybody carried a pocket knife. Even all through high school, you know, my high school years, if if you'd gone through the the high school and and and every guy in the high school was was probably not probably would have a pocket knife in their pocket, and probably 80% of the girls would have one in their purse. Because we were raised on a in a farm culture. I was raised in a town called Waller, and a lot of that was you know was farming and everything else, so it uh and ranching and and that. So everybody carried a pocket knife. Um I um when I got started making knives, I started up, you know, um like most everybody with fixed blades, and I made several fixed blades, and uh I made several liner locks and frame locks and stuff when I got into making folders, and then when I made my first what I would consider traditional folders, slip joint folders, it's like this is what I want to do. And so all of my stuff now is pretty much based on traditional patterns, trappers, stockmans, uh Texas Jacks, uh like that. And so, and that's a lot of that was from you know, my high school days because we everybody either carry you either carried a stockman or a or or a two-blade trapper. I mean, that was just the knives of the day.

SPEAKER_03 14:55

So um when it comes to pattern sourcing, um like what what's your influence with with other makers or how you collected your patterns or things like that? Can you uh talk a little bit about how how exactly you got into building what I would consider a a traditional Texas style two blade trapper?

SPEAKER_00 15:17

Yeah, yeah. That's uh uh course the trapper was just and so the first one I made, I made on my own. And uh uh back then there was the old uh TKCA, Texas Snipemaker Collectors Association, and um uh Bill Ruppel, big part of it. And um I handed it to him and had him look at it and and he said uh it opens, it closes, it works. He said, You got the hardest part down. And uh he said, now the rest of it is aesthetics. But uh, you know, there's one thing about the traditional knife maker uh group is you know, we we the the traditional knife had been around since you know since uh when back in Sheffield, England, back in the 1700s, eighteen hundreds. And so we're really not copying everything, but everybody everybody creates their own style. Um you know, me, uh you one of mine, several of the other makers, you know, if you stack five of our trappers together, a lot of them, you know, you could go, okay, that's you know, that's RuPaul's, that's that's um that's um um Bobby House, that's um, you know, uh Tim Robertson. You just you can just go down because everybody's got enough of their own style that it just shows, even though they all look similar. And uh, but I'm just enamored with traditional patterns. And the good thing about the makers is we all share patterns. You know, I can um you know, I call one of the other makers up and go, hey, I saw this knife you posted today, and I really like that. Would you let me use that pattern? And and sure. And as a matter of fact, one of the patterns I build a lot of today, I call my RH trapper. It's a little three and five eighths closed link trapper, two blade trapper. And it it uh Raymond Hunt um designed it. And I asked Raymond one day, I said, you know, hey Raymond, would you would you be willing to share that pattern with me? And he goes, sure. He said, as soon as we get home from the show, he said, I'll I'll send you the I'll send you the pattern. And we do that all the time. And that's the greatest thing about a lot of the traditional makers, is there's there's not a whole lot of secrets about patterns and stuff. We we exchange them readily.

SPEAKER_03 17:44

That's really cool. Um when you're doing uh kind of uh related to how uh Chris and I know you. Um you use you use a panograph today to inlay all your shields, correct?

SPEAKER_00 17:59

I do now, yes. Yes. I do use a panograph now.

SPEAKER_03 18:04

How how long had you been doing shield inlays uh before that, before using a panograph? And what what was your your technique for that?

SPEAKER_00 18:13

Oh actually, I've only had my panograph maybe a year, maybe, maybe a year and a half, something like that. It I haven't had my panograph long. I actually started out using doing it the old way with parser plates. I would buy pre-cut shields and use a parser plate. And a parser plate is the is the negative of the shield, and you you put it on, you place that parser, what they call parser plate, on top of your handle material, and then you use some kind of cutting tool. Um, I have I use my mill with with cutters, and you would route out all where the shield went in, and then the shield would would inset in it. So uh, but now I you know I use my panagraph, so I cut my own shields and and I inset them with the panograph. But the the parser plate was actually the the way it was done even even back to the old Sheffield houses in England.

SPEAKER_03 19:10

Yeah, my my first few sh uh shield inlays were using parser plates too. I forget uh exactly where I got them from, but I think I still have them in a drawer. But uh I quickly uh funny story. Uh Chris and I had been talking a little bit back in 2019 when I was starting to get into pocket knives after I'd kind of been dabbling in fixed blades for a while, and I was asking him about panographs, and he turned me on to talking with Tim Robertson, and I was able to actually get uh one of his panographs that he had that he was refurbishing, and so that sits in my shop as my primary. But after that, uh after that introduction, I started uh buying uh the uh the templates and everything from Chris, and so that's how uh somehow we got to be more acquainted with each other. But it's kind of uh it's funny how the circle is pretty small on panographs about how inter interconnected a lot of us are with Chris Crawford and and what he does with the templates.

SPEAKER_00 20:12

Oh sure. I get all I get most of all of my templates from Chris.

SPEAKER_01 20:16

Well, I I appreciate that. You saying that. I know it's one thing that that's given me a chance to get to know some of the people who I I might not would have gotten to know otherwise, just because you know they'll they'll contact me about templates and you know, we'll have interaction with them. And then I I I got to go to Blade for the first time, never been before, got to go for the first time last year, and uh I was able to walk around and meet some of the people face to face that I'd you know been doing business with. So that was Aaron, you talk about, you know, it was kind of what got us knowing each other more, but you know, that's that's really been an advantage uh for me is just getting to know other makers as well that I might not would have you know come across or have cross contact with.

SPEAKER_00 21:02

So yeah, that it it's um it's amazing the the and the camaraderie, you know, that that that the knife makers shared that uh um uh we see each other, we don't see each other, we talk to each other a lot, and then we see each other at at shows. And actually, Chris, uh Blade last year was my first time doing actual Blade Atlanta was uh as far as doing it for that show. Uh I'd always done all the local shows here, and you know, uh what ICCE and used to be the you know Texas Time Makers Collectors shows and stuff like that. But I uh last year was my first uh actual going to Blade Atlanta.

SPEAKER_01 21:43

Okay, yeah, I I just went as a visitor and uh walked around. I think Derek Melton and I went, we went together on Thursday. I guess it was Friday and Saturday, is when we were when we were in there. But uh we're we're both getting us a table this year and uh Found out just this week that we get we were able to get our table side by side. And so if you're back this year, Stanley, I'd look forward to getting to meet you face to face.

SPEAKER_00 22:10

Oh yeah, good yeah, I sure would like yeah, I look forward to it. Yeah, I'm on uh I'm on row 13 table E. And uh I was I was very lucky that uh was able to uh get a get a table at this last year and um uh started my uh trip with Blade Atlanta.

SPEAKER_01 22:34

Yeah, we were uh I was kind of concerned if I'd end up getting in the that secondary room, but I think mine's gonna be is like row nine um U, nine U, and I think Derek's is nine V. So uh won't be too far from each other actually then.

SPEAKER_00 22:51

Yeah, we'll be real close right there. Because that's where that that uh row 12 and 13, there's a whole lot of the slip joint makers are all right there. Uh uh Bill Bill's there. Um God, my mind is just locked up. Uh Luke, Luke Swenson, you know, Luke and Bill and and and and Johnny Stout and Bobby House and the whole slip, all the slip joint cartel are all pretty much right there together. And uh I was real lucky to uh to get in a table that was that close to them.

SPEAKER_01 23:30

Yeah. Unless everybody spends all their money before they get to you.

SPEAKER_00 23:38

Yeah, it's uh yeah, that's this is true too. And uh little bit funny, a little bit funny story about Blade shows is Blade Texas last year. Uh we'd gone to the guild meeting that morning, and it this Friday morning, and before the show opened, and we had the guild meeting, and we were in the guild meeting, and we came out, and I was talking to Luke, and the you know, of course, the line was all the way back down, you couldn't even see the other end of it. And um uh down the hallway there, it going in, you know, and we were headed back into the to the room. And I go, I told Luke, Luke, I said, Man, I said, you know, okay, convention is I said this is gonna be looks like it's gonna be a good show. I mean, it's gonna be great. A lot of people. And I he looked down there and he goes, Not enough gray hair in this room, not enough gray hair in here to buy our knives. So it's uh and it's kind of true that the the that first morning they they they hit and it's it's um you know it's all that uh the guys that run for the the booth with you know more of the bench maids and stuff like that. And it and it's it's it's true that a lot of our our collectors and people that buy our knives are usually uh older people, older gentlemen uh and older women and um uh and that um instead of the younger crowd. And I wish we could get the younger crowd more interested in traditional, in more traditional pattern knives. It would I'd like to see that happen.

SPEAKER_01 25:15

Well, if you really want to reach the younger crowd, you need to start putting some butterfly knives on your table.

SPEAKER_00 25:25

I I tried making one of those about seven or eight years ago, and that's it it's still in pieces in a box somewhere on my table. So yeah, that's uh that's a whole nother that's a whole nother outfit there. Between them and automatics, it's uh they're they're in they're interested. And uh getting butterfly knives, getting butterfly knives to work or something.

SPEAKER_01 25:56

Well, I was just trying to get through Blade without getting stabbed. You go back over there where where all those kids were f flipping those butterfly knives.

SPEAKER_00 26:04

Oh yeah. Those guys are something, man. You watch they're just uh they're crazy. And uh, you know, I guess uh, you know, it it yeah, that it's all they can say. I watched, you know, I watch them do that, and it's like, you know, I would I'd end up yellow, there wouldn't be enough band-aid around to patch me up after I tried that.

SPEAKER_03 26:28

I definitely think from a uh a knife perspective and getting the younger generation into it, some of the most influential things are Forge and Fire and these ballasong competitions, uh where they're doing like all the butterfly stuff and everything. So I mean I guess I guess maybe as they s as they m mature and in their their uh what they're looking for for knives, that they might actually hit the slip joint and lockback crowd a little bit more, but especially if uh if their parents passed down things from like their grandparents. Because you know, that's one thing that I uh uh I didn't get any of my grandfather's knives that he uh he he bequeathed. Uh he like they all went to my uncle. Um so mostly me getting into slip joints uh was to remember the fact that you know I grew up with pocket knives and especially uh old Barlows and and single blade trappers and things, but to also remember my grandfather because he uh you know he carried one around everywhere and had a actually a pretty extensive uh slip joint collection in a shop.

SPEAKER_00 27:40

Oh, that's neat. Yeah, that's uh and and like I said, that of course that's the you know the the the group I grew up with. We we just everybody carried a traditional pocket knife. I mean it was just it and it was a tool. You know, it wasn't it wasn't, you know, you know, people say, Oh, are you carrying a weapon? No, I'm not carrying a weapon, I'm carrying a tool. I use this, you know, I use this thing daily for, you know, a hundred different little projects. And even, you know, even today, uh, you know, just put out hay for the cows, you gotta cut hay string. You know, so you know, I'm out cutting hay string and stuff with my, you know, but y and and so to us it's a tool. It's it's um and now true, some of them we make now are are are are very high-end tools. And uh and and we decorate them up and and and you know, create really really nice works of art, but uh, but it all comes it all stems back to that that it's it's man's old it's one of man's oldest tools. And um lost my train of thought. Just went right out the window.

SPEAKER_03 28:52

Yeah, it happens to us a lot.

SPEAKER_00 28:54

And uh, but you know, so uh and that's that's something that that that was that's been missed today is is that that you know you know people say well you carry you can't carry that, that's a weapon. No, we carry it as a tool. You know, and that's I think that's the way the wrong thing has been looked at.

SPEAKER_03 29:13

Yeah, well, uh one thing uh I noticed about your knives, and it it is uh I I would say it's more common in in Texas slip joint makers than I see anywhere else, uh, but it's it's uh uh embellishments like file work and engraving and things. Um what made you decide to start getting your knives engraved and um and on your file work? What what are the things that you like about file work specifically?

SPEAKER_00 29:45

Uh file work to me, I you know, I like doing file work and uh the the the greatest thing about file work in it is when somebody picks a knife up off your table and they kind of turn it over to the spine and their eyes get kind of big and they smile or they just go wow. And you know, that's that's one of the main reasons I do it. We do it for the wow. Um uh it it it's great to when somebody picks up something that you you know you've put hours and hours into, and you know, and somebody picks up and it just it just lights them up, and that just that's worth it. How did I get started getting doing embellishments? It was I'll tell you what, the first knife that I had engraved, I was scared to death. I said, you know, I'm gonna spend all this money on engraving, you know, Alice Carter. I can't say enough about Alice Carter. She's the greatest lady in the world and and a fantastic engraver. And um uh she, of course, she does probably 95% of my engraving. And uh luckily she's only seven or eight miles from me, so that makes it nice too. We're real good friends, other than then she does a lot of work for me. But I had the first, I decided to do the first one. I had a real pretty piece of dark blue black mammoth, and I uh, you know, and some and some damage steel, and I built this knife, it looks really good. And I said, you know, but I made my I think I'm gonna have this one in grave, I'm gonna have this one engraved. And finally broke down and had it done. And uh, but I was scared to death. I thought I'd carry that knife around forever, you know, because nobody's gonna want one of my knives at that kind of money that I'm gonna have to ask for this knife, and and um uh it sold just right away, and I was just tickled, and um uh so it turned into now it's I try to do maybe four to five what I call big knives a year, um uh that are you know just as fully dressed out as they can be. And and I try to keep most of my stuff as as much Texas themed as possible. Uh Bill Poor out of Abilene does I buy a lot of steel from Bill. He's just a great guy, and he makes really good steel. And so all of my knives are pretty, you know, it's there again, we're right back to it's all in Texas. And uh, but just I really got into using doing more art, more art type knives as uh instead of the uh just and I still make a lot of just you know, everyday users, what I consider an everyday user, just a four and a quarter single blade trapper. You know, I still make a lot of those. And and it um but those real big dress knives are just uh and the collector pieces are just uh I just it just uh I don't know, it just excites me. It it uh and it's uh the collaboration with Alice and everything, and and they just work out. And then I look back and I go, man, that turned out nice.

SPEAKER_03 32:57

Well, uh I I know you from doing Texas shows and well your reputation in the in the Texas Knifemakers Guild, uh doing shows uh uh locally, and then also, you know, in the in the time that I've been in the the National Guild. But one one thing that's always uh struck me as an impression that you leave on me is when you go to a show that you're at, uh you're always behind your table, you always have a smile on your face, and you're always standing up. Can you tell me a little bit more about like show etiquette and some of the like maybe some advice to makers on how to conduct themselves at shows? Because I I've always been really impressed by you. And it even though sometimes I don't have uh like money to buy your your knives or whatever, I've always been compelled to just because of your your posture and how you conduct yourself.

SPEAKER_00 33:54

Um you know it's um eighty percent of the people that buy knives are at and let's just be honest, the what we do is is it uh they're more toward toys. Uh we make absolutely nothing that anybody's got to have. They can they can go down and buy a case pocket knife at Walmart for a little bit, you know, a little bit of money and be happy. So um we 80% of the people will buy they buy the maker as much as they buy the knife. Now, true, you have to make a nice knife, but they will buy the maker in instead of and I had somebody tell me many years ago that if if by the end of the day, if you're not totally worn out, then you didn't you didn't then you didn't have a good day at the show. Because like you said, I'm always standing, I talk to everybody. And uh I'm always to the point where, and you know, people will say, well, you know, I can't afford one of your knives. And I said, You can still pick it up and play with it. You can still pick it up and enjoy it. And uh, even though you know you may not be able to buy it, it may be out of your budget, but uh, and maybe I can do something that can meet your budget, but uh the fact is is you can still see this and enjoy it and enjoy something that I made. Uh show etiquette is one of those, is is if you're not standing up talking to people, if you're just sitting behind your table with your arms crossed, you know, people are gonna walk right by you. I talk to everybody. Everybody that walks by the table is hi, how are you doing? What's going on? You know, and and I'm not really hawking the knives, I'm just I'm just I'm greeting everybody. And uh that's the that's the main thing about being there. Um, you know, be professional, be on your feet, and um, you know, do a good clean presentation. You're gonna and you know, some of the makers get kind of upset. Well, I gotta ask a hundred times today where I buy my blades from. You know, you answer every one of them. I don't. Um, you know, I make every piece of the knife. And uh, and and you may answer the same question a hundred times in a day, but every time you answer it, you need to smile because that's another person. You just smile and you answer the question and and be honest with them and um and be personable. Um and and that just that's what brings the people in. And uh yes, you you know, pretty knife sitting on the table is pretty knife sitting on the table, but there there is much when they're gonna invest the kind of money we're talking about that the knives we make, uh you you have to you have to make an impression on those people to to have them pick you over somebody else.

SPEAKER_01 36:50

That's some really good advice for someone like me who's gonna be going for the first time as a you know, as a uh, I guess I don't know if you'd say vendor or or whatever, but it's kind of funny last year, and I've never I've never done a knife show before. Um I've talked, I think think on my podcast a little bit about this Batson Symposium, how they'd have like a little two-hour knife show on Saturday afternoon, but that's the extent of it. But it's funny, last year walking around Blade, I thought, oh my goodness, if I get me a table, I was so worn out just from walking around, I thought if I get me a table, I won't be near as worn out. Excuse me. But uh taking your advice, it sounds like I need to be.

SPEAKER_00 37:32

You you will you will be. If you do it, if you do it right, you will be. Uh, because you're on your feet all day long, you're engaging everybody all day long. You're and the energy, um the I um I did a small video um bit with um with Richard Steinberg from uh Bear Claw Knives out of Midland. He did a he was walking around doing videos with several makers and did a short one with me, and a guy called me and he goes, he says, I want to get one of your knives. And I go, Oh, I appreciate it. And he he goes, yeah, he said, you know, he said, I saw this video that was done, and he said, then your energy, just your energy and your passion, he said, makes me want to want your knives. And that's what you have to, you have to, you're not there just okay, I'm not just there selling widgets. I'm selling a part of me. Every one of those knives is a part of me, and and I I express that.

SPEAKER_03 38:27

Yeah, kind of on that note, something, Chris, uh, to think about with with shows, and I I I hope this is helpful to uh uh listeners and makers who want to actually go and exhibit at shows is the the process of being part of the show is an exhausting one, right? But in addition with that, you have to uh pick up your displays, like you have to you have to cart everything from your rental or your car or wherever, right? And you have to take it to the to your table and you have to set up and some things you might take home uh or to your hotel room uh every day, other things you might leave on the table. And they're there I found over the years there's a process that works pretty well for me. But one item that is indispensable, regardless of whether you whether you're packing slip joints or pocket knives in uh just something that you can carry easily or not, is if you have a display table and you have uh accoutrements uh that you want to take there, get you a little roller tote or something because getting up and down the escalators and things uh is kind of a pain. And if you can put everything in a tote and carry it, then it'll be a lot easier and save some of your energy for for actually interacting with customers and and and showgoers.

SPEAKER_00 39:47

Hmm. Yeah, thanks. Oh yeah, I carry way too much stuff to shows. And and I have a small two I I have a small two-wheel dolly and everything, you know, my table cover, and then I have a cow hide that I put over my table cover, and that all goes in one box. And then I've got a box for my my my satchel with all my knives in it, and then I have a box that has, you know, all of my miscellaneous stuff that goes on my table, my little stands, my setup, my books, my pins, my stickers, all of that stuff. So I'm you know, I've got a two-wheel dolly that's stacked up about three and a half feet high with stuff on it that I can wheel around. Having would having to tote that stuff in by hand would be just a killer. And uh, you know, that's a good if if you're getting ready to do a show, first thing you do, uh, and and to new makers that's gonna do your first show is stage everything at the house first. It sets you out of board, you know, two foot by eight foot or something like that. And set your table up and look at it and though, okay, do I need to take this, do I need to take that, and get everything together that you think you're gonna need and and get it packed up so that you can get it in and out. Because that is, that's and you know, especially uh setup day, especially if you're not gonna get there the day before to set up, if you're gonna get there early in the morning to set up, uh you need to have your act together or you're gonna be stumbling over yourself when the show starts.

SPEAKER_01 41:17

That's some great advice, yeah. That's awesome.

SPEAKER_03 41:20

Yeah, shows with shows, especially if if they start before noon, uh life comes at you fast. And especially like being in the guild or whatever, yeah, they'll do their guild meetings before the show. And so you if you don't have things set up beforehand, uh then you have the guild show or whatever, or meetings or things like that, or even breakfast, and then you have to rush through everything in order to get it set up. So staging is a really good advice too. I hadn't thought about uh that, but I do it every show.

SPEAKER_00 41:49

Yeah, I don't have to stage so much anymore. It's now is is to get the knives ready and and and have them all double checked and and stuff like that. I've I've I've done enough shows over the years that um you know now anymore all of my stuff just stays packed. You know, so so all of my you know, I in about every second or third show I unload everything and then repack it so that make sure, okay, I'm short on this, I need some more of those, uh, and and have everything ready to go. Because and a good thing that nobody thinks of is a battery pack for your phone or if you're gonna use a tablet, or um uh now I've actually got a a picture frame that I put on my table that's loaded with a whole bunch of my pictures. I have my portfolio book, but I have a picture frame now that rotates through pictures and it, you know, I can run it off my uh the auxiliary battery pack. There's nothing worse than three o'clock in the afternoon or two o'clock in the afternoon, and your phone dies. And um, and and you're gonna use it either to take a credit card or PayPal or something like that. Um uh you, you know, it and then your phone's dead. Uh uh a battery, uh, uh a battery backup pack is just an almost a necessity that a lot of folks don't think of carrying to a show.

SPEAKER_03 43:12

Yeah, I agree. Uh Wi-Fi and and show like a Blade Show is probably the example of this, but you know, you have all of these makers uh packed into a single room. And to get on Wi-Fi, like you could pay, I don't know, what is it, like $50 a day or something like that for Wi-Fi if you need to take uh credit card transactions or whatever. But sometimes uh sell signal with all those uh cellulars in the room can be kind of difficult too. So uh, you know, thinking about the technology logistics, like how you're going to take cards, if you're gonna have the internet connection that you need and everything um is important. Um, we we go through this uh every time. I'm like, do do I have the proper internet connection that I need to take cards? I usually test it beforehand to make sure I have enough change. For cash transactions and things. So all of that prep goes a long way in making sure that you spend less time worrying about those logistics of how you're going to sell if if somebody comes to you your table and wants to buy, and more time being able to just enjoy the experience and and you know the customers and and showgoers.

SPEAKER_00 44:20

Yeah, and and the main thing is is to enjoy the people. Um uh everybody that comes up to your table is a is a is a prospective buyer for one. And and besides that is is they're looking at something that you did. And if you can bring a smile to their face when they, you know, like I said, the biggest the biggest thrill to me is when somebody picks up one of my knives or either opens it or or something like that, or just looks at it and just their eyes get big and they smile, and then that's that's the biggest thrill of the whole thing is that you just affected somebody else's attitude for the day, you know, it it or or at least for that moment. And and that means a whole lot.

SPEAKER_03 45:08

Yeah, something something that's interesting too about shows, and you know, that with so many makers that sell online, like with the advent of the internet, the uh the lack of guild shows and everything, and now we're kind of back to having uh syndicated knife shows, is uh the the proximity to greatness that you have. Uh and I'll tell you a story. So I had done some local shows, and then I decided uh to try to get a table at Blade Show Atlanta. And my table was was really good, which I was surprised about. I I I wasn't in the side room, I was in the main room, and uh sitting behind me, there was a knife maker who's older, and everybody was coming up and taking pictures with them and shaking his hand, and he sold uh man, if he didn't sell every knife that day that he had uh originally brought, I'd be surprised. But uh my wife and I decided that we were going to have a candy uh table or candy on the table that we could uh you know, kind of give people refreshers and whatnot, draw them in to just talk and and be uh engaged in what we were doing. And this guy and his wife started uh you know picking off stuff from the the table and everything because they uh you know they were they were older and they didn't have a chance to go to the food court and get stuff. Well, we started talking a little bit more, and that person that I was sitting behind was uh was Steve Johnson of Loveless uh reputation. And and it it didn't take me long, but I was like, you know, I I see your knives everywhere. Like I've grown up looking at your knives, seeing your your logo, uh, but I just never put a an uh a face to those blades. And I was like, I'm just like incredibly honored just to be sitting in proximity to you. And he him and his wife and his son Nate were just the most enjoyable, genuine, loving people. And I still I still talk to Steve uh pretty often, but you you get an opportunity at shows, unlike being on the internet, to really get to know people that you you just would not be able to have the time with because either they're retired or they spend their entire time doing their thing and their knives and and living their life. And I I've always just really enjoyed the the show circuit because of that proximity to greatness. I get I guess it's good to meet amazing people.

SPEAKER_00 47:39

That is one of the greatest things about doing shows is um it the it there, you know, people say, well, you know, what is it about you know Blade Texas or Blade Atlanta? Why why should I bother to go to Blade Texas, Blade Atlanta? Uh it's because you will, if if you like knives at all, you will you will just be it'll just be sensory overload. You will just be blown away by the amount of talent in that room. And um, and and you know, and like you said, and people don't realize it's some of these, you know, mostly we're just all it's just we're just human, you know, and and and we uh you know I'm the same way. I get to, you know, I get to meet people and and my heroes, you know, and and it's just the greatest thing in the world.

SPEAKER_03 48:34

No, I I fully agree. Um something that I I think is interesting to talk about with uh you Stanley is you mentioned portfolios and pictures. And I uh for makers, I I don't really know if a lot of us, you know, starting out think about how important it is to develop a portfolio. But can you talk a little bit more about like your uh your photography, like uh you know, getting your pictures taken and everything? Because if anybody follows you online, especially, you pretty prolifically get your uh your your knives photographed.

SPEAKER_00 49:16

Oh yes, yes. Um uh that's one of the first things I will uh tell a a relatively new maker or you know, somebody, somebody that's uh making their uh early in their knife making career is get your knives professionally photographed. It you know, professional photo uh professional photography does not cost, it pays. Um had my first knife photographed Chuck Ward, when Chuck Ward was still doing photograph years ago. Uh I had Chuck shoot my first one, and um my wife says, You paid, I think it was $125 or $130 at the time, you know, to have it professionally photographed. And and of course you got an eight by ten print, and uh, and he always submitted to all the magazines. And she goes, You spent that much money, just have a picture, take it in your knife? I go, Yeah, I did. And she said, Why? I said, just because you need to start, you know, you need to have a record. And uh so then I don't know, it was a couple of three months later. I went to the mailbox and there was a big envelope in there, opened it up, and it was a copy of Knives Magazine back when it used to be the the tabloid newspaper type magazine. And I go, I don't remember ordering this, and there was a yellow sticky note on it. It says, Your knife is on page number so and so. I literally floated back into the house. And uh, and but the the neat the neat thing was is then I ended up getting four orders off of that magazine that went out. And four people called me and ordered knives from me because they saw that picture in that magazine. They'd have never known about me other than for that. Other than they've taken that picture. And so, and building a portfolio that way, for one, you can see how your own work progresses over the years. But the second thing is, is you know, uh people will stand at my table and they'll sit there and just go through my portfolio. Oh wow, oh look at that one. Oh, wow, that's you know, and and and that's you know, that's another part of the presentation you have to make. There, they're seeing another part of you through the pictures. So uh and it doesn't matter who, you know, Jim Cooper shoots a lot of my pictures, uh, Eric Eggley. Um I mean, there's a whole there's several great photographers out there, but whoever you choose, but uh and and realize that they're not just they're not just giving you a eight by ten for that money. You're getting submitted to all these magazines which will get your stuff published, and that makes a big difference.

SPEAKER_03 52:08

Yeah, the uh the first time uh Tim Tim Robertson uh actually recommended I I tried getting some knives photographed. And uh in addition, I was uh uh ICCE, so it was the first year that Blade Show took them over. I think it was in uh 20, was it 2020, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 52:29

19. 2019 was when uh they yeah.

SPEAKER_03 52:33

Yeah, when did they when did they change the name? It was 2020 that it uh it uh turned over.

SPEAKER_00 52:38

Did they change the name to just Blade Texas? Yeah. Uh ICCE Blade bought Blade had ICCE in 2019. Uh was their first year to have it.

SPEAKER_03 52:49

I'm pretty sure it was 2020 that I went uh to get into the Texas Guild. And um, and I I took this old knife that was a pattern from my fixed blade mentor that I bought my shop from uh that was originally a a stake, a steak knife pattern that he made uh for his uh his daughter's wedding. And I said, you know, this looks like a really good skinner, uh Skinner blade, and so I named it my gentleman's skinner. And it had it had ironwood handles that were like burled ironwood, and I put in uh some dovetailed uh nickel silver bolsters and uh gussied it up real nice. And in the inspection process, and then when I later went to the guild table, they were like, man, like this this would look really good photographed, but you it also looked really great with a taper tag. And I was like, Well, I can't really do anything about the taper tag at this point, but I went through and and polished that up real well and made sure everything looked like as perfect as it could be, and I sent it off to Coop. And I think I think maybe I spent $197 after shipping and everything on it. But uh not not long after, maybe like the next month, I I was looking in Blade Magazine because I had a subscription and I I saw that you know I had a it's like the the highlights that they have for new makers and and other people like that. I I found it pu published in the in the magazine, and that really made me ecstatic. I I almost felt like I didn't deserve it because it was my first photograph that uh Coop had taken. But uh then it got published in also in the the yearly compilation that they have. And I'll tell you, even though it costs a decent amount of money and people might think that it it's a a little bit of a luxury spend, uh, it really did spur me on to have like some of that validation, like to be published with some of your work and to have those those records of it. It really did spur me on to continue uh going down this path that I was for knives. And I I really encourage it for makers, at least to try it out and to be as habitual as you can, uh, especially if you want to build a really good and beautiful portfolio.

SPEAKER_00 55:04

Oh yeah. Yeah, it it uh a portfolio is just you know, people say, well, you know, uh well you have the internet, yeah, but the internet is not the same as as when somebody sits there and just stomach threats through your pictures. Um but and it will that it will spur you on because okay, that one looked really good in that picture. Now everyone you do from then on has got to look at least that good. You you could you can't back up. Excuse me. That's true. Now and and and the ones, you know, the ones that have won me the awards over the last couple of years. It's like uh I'm going out to the shop, it's it's okay. If I'm it's like, okay, that one's going in the trash because it didn't make it. And I can't, you know, I can't let that go anymore. Because I have to keep you have to keep that level of not production, but that level of creativity, that level of of excellence. Um, you know, um my um one of my heroes growing up um was um a coach of the Green Bay Packers, uh uh Vincent Bardi. And and he somebody asked him one time about you know why they practiced so hard. And then said that uh he said, no one will ever achieve perfection. He said, but if we work hard enough, we can at least achieve excellence, and that's what we try for. Um the in and if the day that you walk out to the shop and go, okay, I'm just gonna knock one together to go out, that's the day you have to quit. Because it shows in your work.

SPEAKER_03 57:03

So, Stanley, um we've talked a lot about different advice for makers, shows, photography, um, etiquette, and and presence in shows. Um, but if you can take your experience in knives and speak to uh makers and and those uh knife enthusiasts, uh if there's a if there's some uh golden rule or advice that you would give somebody, what do you think that would be?

SPEAKER_00 57:35

Um my advice to makers is I guess is to never be afraid to reach out to another maker to ask a question or an opinion. And never be most don't be afraid to walk up to a maker and especially another maker. If you're a starting out maker and you you come to my table and you say, Hey, would you look at one of my knives? I would be glad to. And I'll tell you everything that's wrong with it. And uh, and but I'll tell you how to fix everything too. Uh we we don't critique to tear down, we critique to improve. Um and so uh the younger makers is is is don't give up. Uh all of us start. I keep my first knife on my table, and it's the ugliest thing in the world. I keep it in my shop with me. And I look back on it and it's just uh I made it out of a file and some diamond wood, ugliest thing you ever saw in your life. And I was so proud of it at the time. And and so none of us start out great. There's only one way to get good, and that's to do a bunch of it. So, and never be afraid to ask questions. And so, um, you know, and if I can ever be a help to anybody, just you know, reach out to me and and let me know, and I'm always glad to help.

SPEAKER_01 59:06

You know, Stanley, kind of along those the same lines that you're you're speaking of there about you know, reach out to other makers and ask them questions, uh I think it's just as important. You talk about the your first knife, you keep that, and it reminds you of how far you come. I think as makers, it's important for us to be willing, and and I think most of them are, most of everybody I've talked to is, but to to be willing to take the time with the with the younger makers and the people just getting into it. And um, you know, I I I have a I'm not gonna mention his name, but there's a um a maker that does great work that's actually in the area, and this was about the time where I decided, you know, all right, how serious am I gonna get? Now I I I just do knives still as a hobby, but you know, I want the work that I turn out, I want it to be good quality. And so about the time um that I was really trying to decide where I was which way I was gonna go with that, I'd reached out to a guy and basically, you know, I just needed somebody to help me with the finer points like like finishing and and uh embellishments and that kind of stuff. And and the guy said he didn't teach people because you can't teach, what'd he say, you can't teach skill or something. And and it was it was kind of discouraging. And actually, it wasn't long after that where when I reached out to Luke and um and and some of those guys and and got to go out and film them and and see some of this stuff, but it really made an impression on me that I don't want to be that guy, you know, I want to be the guy like you're talking about that's willing to help whoever comes along and and asks. And and you know, there's a as a maker, there's a joy. There's a there's a guy named Wesley, Wesley Crumb, who lives not far from me, and came by my shop a couple years ago, just never made a knife, just wanting to learn a little bit about it, and and he's taken off and just does excellent work. And I find joy in you know thinking that, hey, he he came to my shop. You know, that's that's the first place he came, and I showed him different tools and stuff, and then he he took it and ran with it. And uh, but yeah, for don't be afraid to ask somebody, but also, you know, don't be a jerk when you get asked.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:30

That's that's a big part of it. And you know, I've got and the thing too is um, you know, I'm I'm you know, I'm pushing 70 already. Uh if we do not get the younger guys interested in in building knives, handmade knives, then the art form is gonna go away. So we have to take the younger guys and and get them uh, you know, yes, we could take them, yes, we I pick on them and and and we have a good time. And and but uh you have to have them interested and be passionate about it because if not, uh before long our art form will go away.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:12

Yeah, and I I think that's something that's important to note too, is that for knife makers who have figured it out, um, who who know the the fundamentals of knife making, something important to impart to other new knife makers is not just it's not just uh tips and tricks and things, but the mentality that goes into making good knives, right? Because uh something that I encountered on my knife making journey early on, you know, in the age of the internet and whatnot, and not being uh impressed by anybody's uh shop because I you know just didn't go to people's shops, is that there's lots of there's lots of things that you can pick up on in researching uh making knives that will get you to make a knife uh a knife-shaped object, right? But making a really good looking knife takes a lot of finesse, it takes a lot of um it takes a lot of uh perspective and introspection and pushing your your concept of what you're trying to achieve, right? And I I think that that's something that we have a responsibility to some extent as makers who have you know come before uh to to impress that on them. That you know it's it's okay to take constructive criticism on your knives. But remember, if you ask me honestly what I think about your knife, you have to be willing to accept that constructive criticism because I'm not trying to hurt you, I'm trying to help you help make you better. And people have done it for me, uh sometimes being brutally honest about my work. Uh, but I've always appreciated that that level of honesty because it's only made me a better knife maker.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:00

Oh, absolutely. The most important the most important thing in a knife shop is the want to. You have to have that want to. Um uh you can have all the equipment in the world uh and and and and not make a different and not make a decent knife. And then you can be like like Lurcher, Wolfgang Lurcher, and and have sandpaper and files and make some of the most beautiful stuff you've ever seen in your life. Uh the main thing is the want-to. And and if you have the want to, then you'll find a way to make knives.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:37

Yeah, well, Stanley, it's been really great having you on the show. Um, I speak for everybody out there that you're a real interesting cat. And uh we'll go ahead and post up your social media online rather than you have to go through all of your Instagram, Facebook, and and website and everything. So if anybody's interested in Stanley's work or talking to him, uh feel free to hit our links inside of the the podcast show notes and what we post up on social media and reach out to him. He's a gem and real uh a wealth of information. And I've I've benefited from that as well. So thank you again, Stanley.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:15

Thank y'all so much for having me on. It's been a it's been a real pleasure. Thank you, Stanley.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:20

Thanks, Aaron.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:22

Thank you for listening to another episode of the Good Old Blades Podcast. We really appreciate both Chris and Stanley being here. Just remember that you are loved and God bless.